I FINALLY found a good photobook printer!

[Megan Turnidge]

After being VERY frustrated with Shutterfly, MyPicTales, and Artscow... I finally tried Viovio. Shutterfly has VERY grainy prints... MPT does too and prints rather dark and sometimes yellowish, and the Artscow books were washed out.

First, I want to show you the massive difference in prices. The SF, MPT, and AC books are 8x8 and the Viovio book is 8.5x8.5. You can view pricing specs for each company here: SF (http://www.shutterfly.com/shop/product_c18020-p3101/Photo_Books_8x8_Story_Book), MPT (http://www.mypictales.com/cart/products_pricing.php), AC (http://www.artscow.com/diy/book), VV (http://www.viovio.com/wiki/8.5x8.5+Photo+Book). I was a little confused when I checked out with my VV book because it was higher than I expected... this is because their pricing for different papers and binding options are on a different page on the website. The silk paper is an additional 15% on top of the price. If your get the other paper with the pro bound option (apparently the better binding), it's a flat $3.99 additional charge. Here is a price chart to compare the 8-inch books between the companies. I have chosen the pro bound book for the VV. Also, the custom photo cover does not come standard for MPT (it's extra) so to be fair I did pricing for a custom cover on all the books.

http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj53/mturnidge/pricing.jpg

The bigger the book you do, the greater the savings with VV! Check out that 100 page book! I was amazed at their prices!

Okay, and on to my review. I am so happy with my Viovio book! Unlike my other books, the pictures on the pages aren't grainy. The colors are great!! The paper is more silky than SF paper but isn't too glossy. The cover is GORGEOUS! It isn't quite the quality of my individual Costco prints, but it's the closest I've gotten from a photobook printer! YAY!!! I didn't have any problems with trimmed edges, but I'm always super careful about my margins. ;)

On the downside, the website is crazy. It is hard to navigate and I had to use this online tutorial (http://digiscrapinfo.com/wordpress/2007/11/15/creating-a-viovio-book-the-process/) to upload my book. I also had the help of Sarah (Sarah8914).. THANKS SARAH!! :thumbup: I did contact customer service a few times and they were very quick to reply and were AWESOME!

Turnaround time is longer than SF. My book took a week and a half to get to me... it shipped earlier than their estimates, but I also chose the sloooowest shipping option they had. lol

I am so pleased and I have found my printer!! :wub: :w00t:

Okay, here are the pictures!!

http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj53/mturnidge/cover_web.jpg

http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj53/mturnidge/inside4_web.jpg

http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj53/mturnidge/inside3_web.jpg

http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj53/mturnidge/inside2_web.jpg

http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj53/mturnidge/inside_web.jpg

http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj53/mturnidge/insidedetail_web.jpg

http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj53/mturnidge/bookspine_web.jpg

[Kim]

Thanks for that review! I have been trying to figure out who to print though! I will give them a try!

[sjford0419]

WOW! The book looks amazing!! Definitely have to check them out!

[Mama-to-Elle]

Your book looks Gorgeous... I think i might try getting one printed, I was thinking just doing indivual pages, because i wasnt sure how it would look to have all diffferent looking pages side by side, but yours looks GREAT!!

Thanks for the review!! :)

[*Kelly*]

Megan, I really appreciate your review (+the ones you have done previously) and how thorough you are.. thanks for the price chart too!! Your book looks fabulous.. I adore the cover!! Do they do discounts like Shutterfly and the like? I haven't had a book made (my pages are so random) and would like to do one for myself in the coming months.

[Megan Turnidge]

Megan, I really appreciate your review (+the ones you have done previously) and how thorough you are.. thanks for the price chart too!! Your book looks fabulous.. I adore the cover!! Do they do discounts like Shutterfly and the like? I haven't had a book made (my pages are so random) and would like to to one for myself in the coming months.

No problem! :) They don't do discounts (that I know of) at Viovio, but if you just wanted to test them, you could do a small paper back book... they are very inexpensive. But even when books are on sale at SF and MPT, they won't come close to the low price of a larger book at VV. Hope that helps!

Oh and if ANYONE wants to try Viovio out adn gets stuck, feel free to ask me for help. :w00t:

[wildblueeyez]

your book is fabulous!!! wow....just gorgeous!

[kscwgirl]

Thanks so much for the review!!!!

[momtutu]

Wow - Thanks for the review! I haven't printed a book out yet but have been going back and forth trying to decide between Shutterfly and MyPublisher. I think I'm going to give yours a try!!

[aggiefamily]

Looks great! I am going to try them next.


Psst. What font did you use for your chart? Too cute!

[Becca Bonneville]

Thanks for the review! I have been wanting to make a book! Yours is absolutely beautiful!!!

[Sarah8914]

Yay! I'm so glad you liked it and your pages look great!

Did you do pro-bound for your book? Or was that just for the price comparison? I'm still trying to figure out if I should do that or the "regular" method for my next book.

Definitely check out Viovio, I too am very pleased with them!

[Megan Turnidge]

Looks great! I am going to try them next.

Psst. What font did you use for your chart? Too cute!

lol! That is Pea Bonnie... one of my faves!

[meems]

your book looks fab! thanks for the review! i've been thinking of trying out viovio.

Do you think I could just enlarge my shutterfly ready 8x8 pages to 8.5x8.5 and that would work? I guess I should check out the viovio website.

[Megan Turnidge]

Yay! I'm so glad you liked it and your pages look great!

Did you do pro-bound for your book? Or was that just for the price comparison? I'm still trying to figure out if I should do that or the "regular" method for my next book.

Definitely check out Viovio, I too am very pleased with them!

I didn't do the pro bound for my book, but will for my next book since it will be HUGE. ;)

[Megan Turnidge]

your book looks fab! thanks for the review! i've been thinking of trying out viovio.

Do you think I could just enlarge my shutterfly ready 8x8 pages to 8.5x8.5 and that would work? I guess I should check out the viovio website.

8.5 is actually the trimmed page... you upload 8.75x8.75 pages.

[aggiefamily]

So would you take a layout and add a .25 inch white edge to it? I have a lot of journaling and items that go to the edge.

[mormishmom]

I appreciate all your research!

[Megan Turnidge]

So would you take a layout and add a .25 inch white edge to it? I have a lot of journaling and items that go to the edge.

Do you only have the jpegs? I resized my layered files so my paper went all the way to the edge. I wouldn't recommend adding white borders unless you wouldn't care if you had white edges in your book. Any place you print a book, you need to allow for bleed and binding. If you don't have the layered files anymore, you could take your eye dropper to sample your BG paper and then fill the canvas with that so at least it wasn't white.

[Jenn Barrette]

When I take bleed into account, I add a .25 trim of my background color, so that if they don't cut them properly, you wont have white edges left.

[meems]

8.5 is actually the trimmed page... you upload 8.75x8.75 pages.
ah ok, makes sense, thanks!

[Jennifer]

Your book looks great!!! Thanks for the review!

[chastml]

Thanks for the review! Your book looks great. I just mentioned Viovio to my sister as a possibility for printing minibooks for her wedding. Glad to know I wasn't suggesting bad quality.

[crystalbird]

Your book looks awesome! Thanks for the review - I'll have to give them a try!

[suzann]

Great review Megan! I'm so glad that you found a book that you like! I was hoping for something close to Costco! I know where I'll be printing now!

[Voodoo_Bryn]

hmm... i only print 8x8's for gifts, and 12x12's for personal, do they do 12x12's?

I really liked your cover, too, Megan, very impressive! (you make me want to start back up on the baby book I keep starting)

[Megan Turnidge]

hmm... i only print 8x8's for gifts, and 12x12's for personal, do they do 12x12's?

I really liked your cover, too, Megan, very impressive! (you make me want to start back up on the baby book I keep starting)

Thanks! I was really happy with the cover too! :)

They do 12x12 books, but they don't have a large enough printer for a custom photo cover... it is die cut... like this: http://www.viovio.com/wiki/index.php?structure_id=470

[Connie Jean]

awesome. I know where I'll be going next time. Thanks for the review!

[scarletsierra]

Thanks so much for taking the time to share such a detailed review Megan!!

[CA Dreamer]

Hi
I went to the VV site. So, do you upload pdfs of your page? If so, about what size files are your pdfs? I was just wondering what quality I should be converting my files to pdf. Press quality? Sorry for the q's. I have been wanting to do a book for a long time now and was in 'analysis paralysis' about what company to use! Thanks for the detailed review! Soooo appreciated!

[Megan Turnidge]

Hi
I went to the VV site. So, do you upload pdfs of your page? If so, about what size files are your pdfs? I was just wondering what quality I should be converting my files to pdf. Press quality? Sorry for the q's. I have been wanting to do a book for a long time now and was in 'analysis paralysis' about what company to use! Thanks for the detailed review! Soooo appreciated!

No, I uploaded my jpegs. You can actually upload them at 12x12 for any of the square books, but you just want to make sure you have the margins for the bleed (I personally uploaded 8.75x8.75 pages with important stuff 1/4 inch from every edge). The best way to upload your pages is to rename them in order with numbers in front of them (i.e. 01love, 02cuddlebug, 03daddysgirl, etc) so you don't ahve to worry about reordering the pages in their software and then zip them up into zip files. Check out this site, it will help TONS!
http://digiscrapinfo.com/wordpress/2007/11/15/creating-a-viovio-book-the-process/

And the templates for the covers are here:
http://www.viovio.com/wiki/index.php?structure_id=448

[joelsgirl]

You're like the bff I always wanted.

I have the feeling if I lived near you I would never have a bad outfit cuz you'd just tell me straight up how to dress.

And I would always save money cuz you'd be tellin' me about the great deals you found.

And I would have the best shadows cuz you would be like, "uh-uhh, honey, that aint' workin'."

Have you ever considered a move to Malaysia?

[lizzyfizzy]

hehehe! kellie, i totally see that too, i love informative people who actually know what the hay they are talking about! megan...so excited to try viovio! i am actually excited to do a book now!

[JenTapler]

Thank you SOOOO much Megan! I have only printed one photobook through Creative Memories and loved the quality but it was CRAZY expensive so I won't be doing that again. I was just about to try shutterfly when I found this thread. I can't tell you how much I appreciate this! Your book looks great!! Now I just have to figure out how to bookmark this thread so when I'm ready to print I can come back and find this info again!!! :)

[mommy2aria06]

This is great information Megan!! There are so many choices I was getting confused so I really appreaciate you putting it all in a chart! Thanks!!

[lacidock]

OMG...your book is gorgeous!! Thanks for the review, I can't wait to print a book!

[momtutu]

I'm sorry Megan - I am soooo confused. I want to eventually put my LO's in an album but am confused about what size you make the LO to upload and all this talk about bleeding and .25 is making my brain hurt. Can you explain, in dumb dumb terms for me, what I would need to do to: #1 - Do a 12 x 12 album correctly (I've done all my LO's as 12x12 and I just fill up the page - there are no white edges on my borders but I don't want to lose anything). #2 - If I wanted the hardcover book(like the 10x10 or 8x8) but I have 12x12 LO's, what do I do the make those fit? I use PSE3 if that helps any. If this is too much to ask or someone knows a tutorial on what to do, I'll be happy to look at it.

[Aggie Aviso]

The book and your recommendation look so promising Megan!

[AllieP]

What a great review! I'm glad you found a printer that you like! I'll have to try them out sometime.

[Megan Turnidge]

You're like the bff I always wanted.

I have the feeling if I lived near you I would never have a bad outfit cuz you'd just tell me straight up how to dress.

And I would always save money cuz you'd be tellin' me about the great deals you found.

And I would have the best shadows cuz you would be like, "uh-uhh, honey, that aint' workin'."

Have you ever considered a move to Malaysia?

Bwahahahaha! This made me LOL!! :D

[Megan Turnidge]

I'm sorry Megan - I am soooo confused. I want to eventually put my LO's in an album but am confused about what size you make the LO to upload and all this talk about bleeding and .25 is making my brain hurt. Can you explain, in dumb dumb terms for me, what I would need to do to: #1 - Do a 12 x 12 album correctly (I've done all my LO's as 12x12 and I just fill up the page - there are no white edges on my borders but I don't want to lose anything). #2 - If I wanted the hardcover book(like the 10x10 or 8x8) but I have 12x12 LO's, what do I do the make those fit? I use PSE3 if that helps any. If this is too much to ask or someone knows a tutorial on what to do, I'll be happy to look at it.

Hey Kelli, do you keep your layered files? Or do you only have the jpegs? Let me know.... I could do a tutorial for you, k?

[scrappinsweetie]

i keep my layered files. i am really interested in this. i was going to have my pro lab print an album but it was going to be 150 bucks and i can't cough that much up right now...LOL

[momtutu]

I don't usually keep the layered PSD files. Once I'm done with a lo, I merge all the layers and then save as a jpeg and then I also make the lo smaller and save for web. Should I be saving the layers? I always figured if I'm done with it, I could just save two things instead of 3. Thanks for your help!!

[Megan Turnidge]

I don't usually keep the layered PSD files. Once I'm done with a lo, I merge all the layers and then save as a jpeg and then I also make the lo smaller and save for web. Should I be saving the layers? I always figured if I'm done with it, I could just save two things instead of 3. Thanks for your help!!

I always keep my layered files... some people keep them for a short time. I like to have my layered files so I can fix typos, change stuff if I need to, and it helps if I need to make a gift in a hurry and I can just switch out my photos for someone else... and so I can make sure that whoever I decide to print with I can adjust the margins for bleed. Book printers need the bleed room so your pages have no white edges on them. They get printed adn trimmed so the image extends all the way to the edges. Plus, you want to make sure you're got some wiggle room for your spine so things aren't getting lost in the binding.

You could still make a book if you wanted to though. Your 12x12 should be uploaded at 12.25x12.25, so you can resize like this....
Go to Image>Resize>Canvas Size, check the box for "Relative" and resize the width and height to 0.25. This should make your canvas larger but your page will remain the same size. You'll see a white or transparent border around your page. Then, if you don't want white edges, you could take your eye dropper tool to sample your LO's background paper and then use your paint bucket to fill the canvas. Then you'd have your LO with a small border all the way around in a color similar to your BG paper and it wouldn't be as obvious as a white border. If any of your LO have really important stuff (like journaling) RIGHT on the edge, I'd make your page a little smaller on that new canvas so you'd have a bigger border (1/4" border on each side rather than 1/8" border... adding 0.25 inches to your LO ends up as 1/8 border on each side). Does that make sense?

My understanding is that with Viovio, you can upload the 12x12's for any size square book, but you'd need to make your margins larger because as they resize your 12x12 down, the margins will get smaller (i.e. .25 border on a 12x12 does not make a .25 border on an 8x8).

[Tracie Stroud]

Wow! Thanks for the review! Your book looks awesome!

[sammi]

Thank you, thank you!!! I have been deliberating this back and fourth. I found a great printer for my 12x12 pages, but really wanted to do a book too. Creative memories is crazy expensive and this looks awesome. :)

[scrappychic]

Looks great Meeeegan! I wasn't happy with Artscow either.

[momtutu]

Thanks Megan! I've got a lot of work ahead of me I think to change all my lo's.

[ashleyprugh]

thanks for the review. i'm gonna check them out. i have all of my current stuff sized for shutterfly, and won't redo them. but for future pages, i'm gonna check out viovio.
thanks!

[momtutu]

Ok Megan, another question...I enlarged my canvas and painted it to match my border and saved it. I am just uploading it to viovio for grins and it sure is taking a long time to upload that jpg. Is the "pdf upload wizard" faster? I could start saving the pdf files and do it that way if it is.

[Megan Turnidge]

Ok Megan, another question...I enlarged my canvas and painted it to match my border and saved it. I am just uploading it to viovio for grins and it sure is taking a long time to upload that jpg. Is the "pdf upload wizard" faster? I could start saving the pdf files and do it that way if it is.

I wouldn't know how to do a pdf upload... for that I think you upload your entire book in one pdf...

I uploaded my jpegs and when I just uploaded a few it didn't take very long at all. But I have a high speed connection.

[momtutu]

I've got a high speed connection too but it sure seemed slow. I looked again and you're right, the pdf thing is to upload the entire book.

Ok, I've gone back to all of my layouts that I've done (only 27 total hehe) and changed the canvas size. I'll do that from here on out on the rest of my layouts. Thanks again!

[Sarah8914]

Definitely zip up your files too! It'll take time to upload, but you can walk away and do other things. Better than uploading 20-30 individual files!

[momtutu]

Ok, I'll bite - how do you zip up your files? I'm maybe I should just start my own "Let's all get together and help the dum-dum scrapper" thread!! :-)

[Sarah8914]

Well, most windows comes with a program called winzip, if not, you can download it free I believe.

You select all the files you want and right click, you should have an option to zip, compress or add to archive. Then it'll zip them up! That's the short version. If that doesn't help, let me know! (or maybe someone else has a better short version..)

[momtutu]

Ok, got it - so I looked at this and so when I click on several things, then right click, I get "send to" and there is a compressed/zip folder. So then....where is this folder located? Do I get to decide? How many files can go in there? And then, when I go to upload files on VV (for instance), that one zip file will go in one slot right? And that will open up all of the pictures separately into VV?

[lovely1m]

I have heard great things about them, but honestly their website is such I mess, I won't bother with it.

[bellbird425]

it does look fab! i can't believe how cheap they are from ur chart too! ur on a winner for sure

[Sarah8914]

Ok, got it - so I looked at this and so when I click on several things, then right click, I get "send to" and there is a compressed/zip folder. So then....where is this folder located? Do I get to decide? How many files can go in there? And then, when I go to upload files on VV (for instance), that one zip file will go in one slot right? And that will open up all of the pictures separately into VV?

You should get to pick the folder. I think digiscrapinfo recommended putting 30-50 mb's of layouts in each folder, I think for me that was 10-15 but I don't remember for sure. And yes, it goes in one slot and opens all the pictures separately!

[NewbieScrapGirl]

Question, Megan!!

I uploaded my files to Viovio and when I preview my book/pages, there is white at the top and bottom of the "page". How do I fix that?

If it helps, I'm doing a 12x12 square book...er..trying to.

Thank you so much!

[Megan Turnidge]

Question, Megan!!

I uploaded my files to Viovio and when I preview my book/pages, there is white at the top and bottom of the "page". How do I fix that?

If it helps, I'm doing a 12x12 square book...er..trying to.

Thank you so much!

Hmmm... what size did you upload? Is it 12x12 or 12.25x12.25? Maybe just email their customer service at support@viovio.com and they should be able to help you with that! Sorry, I didn't have that problem. Definitely contact them, they were super helpful!

[NewbieScrapGirl]

uh-oh

They were 12x12, probably. Was the 12.25x12.25 referring to someone doing what I'm doing? Sorry...I'm so new to this!

:o

[Megan Turnidge]

uh-oh

They were 12x12, probably. Was the 12.25x12.25 referring to someone doing what I'm doing? Sorry...I'm so new to this!

:o

No problem! Viovio recommends uploading pages that are 0.25 inches bigger on each side. They will take your 12.25x12.25 page and trim off the edge (so make sure you don't have anything really important on the edge or it will get cut off) so it is 12x12. Then they'll bind that into the book so you wanna really make sure nothing really important like text is really close to the edge so it doesn't get lost in the binding (this goes for any photobook printer... they all need some bleed room so they can trim and bind). Does that make sense? I personally make sure important stuff is at least 1/4 inch away from each edge and I've never had anything chopped off.

For 12x12 books upload 12.25x12.25 pages
10x10 upload 10.25x10.25 pages
8x8 upload 8.25x8.25 pages

[NewbieScrapGirl]

Thank you so much for your help. And you didn't even make me feel worse for the wear! ;)

I'll try re-uploading with that size and go from there.

[evelester]

I could use a tutorial on the 12x12 pages- I do have all my layered files still and made the mistake of putting some things right up to the edge- not on alot thank goodness! LOL I will never do that again, but yeah, what do I need to do to get my 12x12 psd's to look beautiful in the book, --- thanks from a newbie!!!!

[Megan Turnidge]

I could use a tutorial on the 12x12 pages- I do have all my layered files still and made the mistake of putting some things right up to the edge- not on alot thank goodness! LOL I will never do that again, but yeah, what do I need to do to get my 12x12 psd's to look beautiful in the book, --- thanks from a newbie!!!!

With the PSD's it's no problem! What program are you using? In PSE, I do this... open the PSD in the PSE Editor and then go to Image (along the top)>Resize>Canvas Size, check the box for "Relative" and resize the width and height to 0.25 inches. This should make your canvas larger but your page will remain the same size. Then simply enlarge your BG paper to fill the canvas. Then make sure really important stuff is at least 1/3 inch away (like journaling) from each edge.

[evelester]

ahhh, that sounds simple enough! LOL I use PSP but it is basically the same! I will go resize all my layouts ASAP, and from now on start with them that size! LOL

[evelester]

how much of the left and right side will be lost by binding? will the .25 accommidate for that as well?

[Megan Turnidge]

how much of the left and right side will be lost by binding? will the .25 accommidate for that as well?

The added .25 (which actually is 1/8 for each edge) is for trimming. So, you upload the 12.25 and then they trim it to 12x12 to create "full bleed" pages (taking 1/8" off each edge). Then that's why I place important stuff at least 1/3 inch from each edge to allow for the binding. ;)

[ShortCake]

Your book looks awesome! I want to do one for a Christmas present for someone and have been checking around.