Legality of Pinterest?

[marlathrall]

Okay, I saw a post/debate on a photography fan page this weekend that turned me on to some serious problems with Pinterest. Apparently, I think anytime you pin something it's totally illegal and a violation of copyright. :/ I love my Pinterest, but I am seriously thinking about deleting all my boards, printing my favorite recipies and only using it to search for inspiration.

Here are two very helpful articles about the problem:

http://ddkportraits.com/2012/02/why-...ration-boards/

http://greekgeek.hubpages.com/hub/Is...ght-Violations

What do you girls think? I love a lazy afternoon of pinning, but I'm beginning to think it isn't worth the legal risk until they get intellectual laws all ironed out.

[sprauncey1]

I saw that as well on CM and it definitely makes me think/worry. I know a lot of people just say "oh they will never go after me because I'm just a nobody" but that is what they said about Napster and the like and people did get sued! Pinterest needs to re-define itself legally because right now THEY are the only ones protected and everyone else is at risk.

I love Pinterest and think it is a really neat idea, but what they claim to be their aim (sharing of ideas on the internet) and what they legally have (ability to copy/sell/alter whatever is submitted to their site) are way off from each other. I'm just hoping they "hear" our concerns and redefine their user's policy.

[Megan Turnidge]

I'm personally not worried about it. I don't completely get if someone pins your photo correctly (linked to the source/your website) why the creator of the image would want to seek out the pinner and sue them. Totally ridiculous. Pinterest is the #1 referrer to my blog and gives me tons of traffic. I love when people pin my stuff. Some people do need a lesson on pinning properly though.

The whole Terms of Service people are worried about... I think they're reading too much into it and I'm willing to bet Pinterest will soon clarify all the legal mumbo jumbo.

[Megan Turnidge]

Originally Posted by sprauncey1

I love Pinterest and think it is a really neat idea, but what they claim to be their aim (sharing of ideas on the internet) and what they legally have (ability to copy/sell/alter whatever is submitted to their site) are way off from each other. I'm just hoping they "hear" our concerns and redefine their user's policy.

I saw someone interpret that part of the transfer/sell/copy verbiage as meaning that Pinterest can copy the images for storage or in the event of a sale/transfer of the site to new owners, they could transfer the images.

[Susan Bartolini]

Originally Posted by mturnidge

I'm personally not worried about it. I don't completely get if someone pins your photo correctly (linked to the source/your website) why the creator of the image would want to seek out the pinner and sue them. Totally ridiculous. Pinterest is the #1 referrer to my blog and gives me tons of traffic. I love when people pin my stuff.

The whole Terms of Service people are worried about... I think they're reading too much into it and I'm willing to bet Pinterest will soon clarify all the legal mumbo jumbo.

^^^ This.

[hollyxann]

I'm with Megan on this one.

I do understand the risks and where these stories are coming from, however, when you upload something to the internet you are doing it knowing that others will see it and you also take that risk of people stealing your images or ideas. Please don't think I condone people doing this, but that is one of the risks you take.

[kristijoy]

I don't think pinterest is the only one that is part of this debate. Google has been underfire recently too. There are definately some legitiment questions out there that have yet to be ironed out. I suspect that the real debate is just beginning. The internet has exploded at a rate that all the legal issues/ramifications/business models/privacy/copyright etc... are still catching up.

[MamaBee]

I've seen this too... and I guess my thinking is that there is code people can put in their blogs that blocks pinning... so if they are worried about people "stealing" from them... they can do that - or don't put it on the web to begin with. that is my two cents...

[mariewilcox]

I personally feel that if you don't want something copied, etc. then don't put it on the world wide web. Once you post something it is out there for the whole wide world to see/use/copy etc. Doesn't mean that I do this or condone this, but it is what it is and the Web has changed our world for better or worse, take your pick.

[Stacey42]

I'm with Megan as well.

Pinterest needs to fix their pin code so people can't pin from google searches, like they keep you from pinning from Facebook. That would eliminate a lot of the uncredited pins right there. And maybe do a pop up explaining/reminding people about going to the source to get the image.

[krystalhartley]

I"m with Megan. There will always be people who abuse, take advantage of, and misuse intellectual property. There is soooooooooo much "bad" on the web, and there are soooo many trolls, bullies, thieves, and more, as well. STill, at the end of the day, I'm 100% happier with the internet in my life.

Pinterest, youtube, google...the resources available on the web add so much value to my life via inspiration, knowledge, friendship, time-savers and much more. I'll put up with the negative to continue to enjoy the blessings and profits. I'm certainly not willing to live in a bubble and hoard all my knowledge, inspiration, family successes, etc. to myself for fear that somebody might try to make a buck off of a photo.

[marlathrall]

Ek. I don't see it quite the same as you guys. A couple of weeks ago, a local teenager took one of my pictures off facebook, cropped the logo off, and edited it like crazy in an ap on her phone. She then reposted it to facebook where I'm her friend. I politely asked her to remove my picture, thinking she needed to be informed about copyright law. I was then torn apart by five adults and told I was being a bully and that the picture was crap anyway. It was disheartening because I really, really just wanted her and understand about copyright.

I'm starting to feel like it's all a slippery slope. Creeps on the internet gather pictures of little kids for predators. They can turn a normal, perfectly acceptable pose into something suggestive. If I found out one of my pictures was being used that way, I would want to sue the crap out of someone. Well, if you allow pinterest to do the same thing you are setting a precedent, right?

It's hard because I really like pinterest and I enjoy looking their for inspiration (especially food, yum) but from now on I know I will be a more informed user and think twice about repinning something. I don't think I'm living inside of a bubble or anything. This afternoon, I will be spending a few hours going through all my pins and making sure they all have working links and credit given, too.

[BrattyMeg]

Originally Posted by marlathrall

Ek. I don't see it quite the same as you guys. A couple of weeks ago, a local teenager took one of my pictures off facebook, cropped the logo off, and edited it like crazy in an ap on her phone. She then reposted it to facebook where I'm her friend. I politely asked her to remove my picture, thinking she needed to be informed about copyright law. I was then torn apart by five adults and told I was being a bully and that the picture was crap anyway. It was disheartening because I really, really just wanted her and understand about copyright.

That's just stealing an image..not sure why Pinterest even matters in that case. When you pin something correctly it's just basically keeping you from having to bookmark the website on your computer...I look at pinterest as an online bookmark inspiration board not as an avenue for stealing images or ideas

[hollyxann]

Originally Posted by FlirtatiousBrat

That's just stealing an image..not sure why Pinterest even matters in that case. When you pin something correctly it's just basically keeping you from having to bookmark the website on your computer...I look at pinterest as an online bookmark inspiration board not as an avenue for stealing images or ideas

EXACTLY! That's how I describe pinterest to people.

[krystalhartley]

I see what you're saying, and I"m certainly sorry you've had a negative experience. I think a lot of us probably have been on the "victim" side of misuse and theft when it comes to the things we have online.

I'm kind of a Nazi about it in my home in terms of product licensing, etc. My kids know they are never to "borrow" music from friends or download from anywhere except iTunes or with special permission from us. All of our software is properly licensed; I refuse to make copies of DVDs that we rent, etc. It's caused some awkward family moments with relations who just don't see it the same way. And I'm very quick to explain that "in my line of work..." to help them gain a little perspective.

Anyways, all that to say, yeah. I get it. I hope that sites that aren't interested in using Pinterest as a marketing tool will add the code to prevent such from happening. I hope there is significantly more eductation for pinners so that everything is properly linked to its source. It is such a valuable tool as a pinner and a business generating traffic. I'd love to see a happy future.

[Tracie Stroud]

I agree, that's exactly how I explained it to my mom when she asked what Pinterest was. I told her it's a visual way to bookmark ideas and inspiration.

[Jenn Barrette]

It might make it a little easier for people to steal images, but so does Google any other search engine. I think that is just the risk you take when you post an image on the web.

[Amy Carey]

Meg said exactly what I was thinking ... it's more a visual bookmarking system in my mind and easier to categorize, etc. People that steal, are going to steal. Doesn't matter the venue, they will find a way, sad to say.

[lovely1m]

So I think I might finally try pinterest. Anyone wanna send me an invite?

ETA, thanks for the invites, girls! Let's see if I can figure this out now. I have the newest version of IE and there was no instructions for how to put the pin on it, so I am not sure I did it right.

[mariewilcox]

Just sent you an invite Mari

[Nettio]

I think the reality is the traditional model of copyright has become antiquated with regards to the tech heavy, social media sharing world we live in today.

What you need to be looking at is intent. The intent behind someone downloading a photo off Facebook, cropping out the watermark and uploading it to their own account is totally different from someone bookmarking and sharing an image with a direct link back to the copyright holder's site. Where bills like SOPA get it wrong is they try to paint all copyright violations with the same broad brush when in reality it's not that black and white in today's world.

What I think we'll eventually see is the way sites like Pinterest, Google, etc, link to copyrighted media will end up falling under fair use, much the way using copyrighted material for critique, satire or education purposes does now. But it's still all fairly new so yes, you're going to see some debates before everything gets worked out. In the meantime, I'll be off pinning away...

[Darcy Baldwin]

sent you one, Mari

[Darcy Baldwin]

I don't have a problem with pinterest, at all, if people would just link correctly, and not copy complete content from a site to the pin (recipes or tutorials). That is not fair use.

[KristinCB]

Originally Posted by Nettio

I think the reality is the traditional model of copyright has become antiquated with regards to the tech heavy, social media sharing world we live in today.

What you need to be looking at is intent. The intent behind someone downloading a photo off Facebook, cropping out the watermark and uploading it to their own account is totally different from someone bookmarking and sharing an image with a direct link back to the copyright holder's site. Where bills like SOPA get it wrong is they try to paint all copyright violations with the same broad brush when in reality it's not that black and white in today's world.

What I think we'll eventually see is the way sites like Pinterest, Google, etc, link to copyrighted media will end up falling under fair use, much the way using copyrighted material for critique, satire or education purposes does now. But it's still all fairly new so yes, you're going to see some debates before everything gets worked out. In the meantime, I'll be off pinning away...

lynnette for president! woot!

[Megan Turnidge]

Originally Posted by Nettio

I think the reality is the traditional model of copyright has become antiquated with regards to the tech heavy, social media sharing world we live in today.

What you need to be looking at is intent. The intent behind someone downloading a photo off Facebook, cropping out the watermark and uploading it to their own account is totally different from someone bookmarking and sharing an image with a direct link back to the copyright holder's site. Where bills like SOPA get it wrong is they try to paint all copyright violations with the same broad brush when in reality it's not that black and white in today's world.

What I think we'll eventually see is the way sites like Pinterest, Google, etc, link to copyrighted media will end up falling under fair use, much the way using copyrighted material for critique, satire or education purposes does now. But it's still all fairly new so yes, you're going to see some debates before everything gets worked out. In the meantime, I'll be off pinning away...

You rock.

[SeattleSheri]

I agree with Lynnette.

[kscwgirl]

Originally Posted by Nettio

I think the reality is the traditional model of copyright has become antiquated with regards to the tech heavy, social media sharing world we live in today.

What you need to be looking at is intent. The intent behind someone downloading a photo off Facebook, cropping out the watermark and uploading it to their own account is totally different from someone bookmarking and sharing an image with a direct link back to the copyright holder's site. Where bills like SOPA get it wrong is they try to paint all copyright violations with the same broad brush when in reality it's not that black and white in today's world.

What I think we'll eventually see is the way sites like Pinterest, Google, etc, link to copyrighted media will end up falling under fair use, much the way using copyrighted material for critique, satire or education purposes does now. But it's still all fairly new so yes, you're going to see some debates before everything gets worked out. In the meantime, I'll be off pinning away...

[lovely1m]

OK, I am confused, how do I pin things on the internet that are not already on someone's board? I have the newest version of IE.

[Darcy Baldwin]

2 ways, Mari

Click ADD, drop down to add a pin, then input the url

Or

Click ABOUT>PIN IT BUTTON - and download the little app to put in your bookmark bar and then whatever website you are on, you just click that little button, and it pins from that site. It's much easier.

[lovely1m]

Thanks, Darcy! I just kept thinking I should have a button not a thing in my favorites. lol

This should be fun. I finally caved as I realized I had only been going to allrecipes for my recipes and not any of my other favorites out of convience.

[Ginger_79]

Well, I just went and looked at my boards. I realised, there were some re-pinned images, that don't link back to the original source. So I deleted those.

I started thinking a bit. In general I agree with Lynnette and the others. However, I also realised that sometimes the source the images link to, are blog posts and not the original source. So I looked at it like Lynnette did under the idea of intention and also if my pinning could do any harm. I decided to delete a few boards. I did keep the scrapbooking and crafting ones. Those are the ones I mostly use anyway. And the ones where it makes sense for me to browse images instead of links.

I have however vowed to ask every owner of the images, if he/she is fine with me pinning it over the next weeks. I guess that's the best a Pinterest lover can do at the moment with everything being a grey zone. I think many will be fine with it. After all posting a layout in an online gallery usually means you want to share it. But nevertheless. Many scrap kids and other people, so they might be ok to publish it on a scrapbooking site, but not on a massive social media site.

[YepBrook]

I see pinning as a visual bookmark, not copying. It's virtually the same as my bookmarks folder, but with pictures!!! If a pin doesn't link to the original source I don't find it useful. Sometimes, if I love a picture and want to pin it from the source (and not re-pin the one that someone got from a Google search) I use Tin-Eye to track it down. I must admit, not all of my pins fit this standard because sometimes I do re-pin sometimes without investigating the link.

[maryinaz]

The thing is, if you put up photos/images on the web, you have NO idea if they have been used for a different purpose already, even before Pinterest was in existence. Even if you put a watermark smack dab in the middle of the image, there are ways around that if you are good with Photoshop. It's the nature of the beast.

I have a layout on scrapbook.com that has been pinned over 150 times according to their Pin counter (that's a lot for me), but I'll be danged if I can even find ONE instance of it on Pinterest. I tried searching on everything I could think of and found nothing. The search on Pinterest is pretty sucky right now, so good luck to the people trying to hunt down the ones who are pinning their images without proper sourcing.

[mrshobbes]

I agree with Lynnette. I'm also having a feeling of deja vu with regards to agreeing with Lynnette, lol

[d2vasquez]

Originally Posted by mrshobbes

I agree with Lynnette. I'm also having a feeling of deja vu with regards to agreeing with Lynnette, lol

ahahahahaha....I was thinking the same!

I read the whole thread and had seen some people posting about the controversy about Pinterest but I guess for me, it is just a way I can bookmark things that I want to go back to later on. Similar to what others have said....I won't lie, I find it the most resourceful tool I have for my busy schedule and I just love it!

[Jengerbread88]

I agree with Lynette.

Before pinterest, I used to bookmark things (my bookmarks folder still has WAY too much in it) and I used to save images into files on my computer- I had folders for fashion inspiration, home inspiration, recipes, etc. Then, I could just look through pictures of it.

I don't see how that's any different than pinterest, with the exception that it's offline vs. online.

I plan on waiting and seeing what happens with it first.

[ktanker]

I really loved reading through this thread. There is a lot of great insight here.
I am a new photographer and also design digitally and I actually want to see my work listed on pinterest. I feel like it's an honor.

Now it is something totally different when someone takes your image and crops out the logo, etc... I do want my logos and my name on it, but as long as that is the case and the images aren't being used for profit by someone else, then I think I am good with the extra (and free) advertising.

There's been some debate too about posting layouts and scrap kits and while I don't think anyone should pin an entire store of products at one time, pinning their favorites as a "bookmark" to go back when you want to buy something is great, like a big wish list for all your stores. Same thing for the layout inspiration. Just be sure you link to the item you are pinning and it's good enough for me.

[KateD]

I don't have a problem with Pinterest as long as it's being used as it was intended. I also agree with the folks who said that the copyright laws are somewhat antiquated; hopefully they'll be updated for this age of social media while still protecting the copyright holders.

Oh, and I have to say that I totally adore Pinterest; it has made me feel so much more organized!

[Nettio]

Originally Posted by mrshobbes

I agree with Lynnette. I'm also having a feeling of deja vu with regards to agreeing with Lynnette, lol

[sailwemust]

People (i.e. all of us) are being taken advantage of - I'm not a trained legal expert. I have to rely on others for all kinds of things - how much I owe the utility company, what needs to be fixed on my car, and what's legal to pin or repin or not. It's disheartening in a broad sense that companies and even individuals are simply passing the buck (if you read the articles listed in post 1, Pinterest basically has you agree to accept all legal responsibility and absolve them of anything and everything). I have a job and serve a particular role in society - it's really frustrating that the folks who are supposed to be serving other roles (i.e. pinterest and ....insert a million other companies here) are basically saying, nah, we're gonna put it all on you (even though we know you can't possibly afford the time, money, and effort to get a lawyer and figure this all out - and that's just for pinterest - how many gazillion other legal issues are out there that we ought to investigate but don't?). I get that people are responsible for "reading the fine print" and making informed decisions, but how far can that really extend in a practical way?

I'll probably be going through my pins tonight checking links and thinking about copyright...sigh.