I have a legal type question about arraignments

[jessica31876]

The guy who caused the car accident in July has been charged with the ACCIDENT in CIVIL TRAFFIC COURT! There is a fine listed of 164 dollars. It says lower down that there is a mandatory appearance and arraignment scheduled for December 22nd. Does that mean the criminal charges will be done then? Does it mean he is not being charged? I do not understand why they would issue a ticket first and not file the charges officially if he is going to be charged. It has me worried because the case is listed under a civil traffic infraction and all he was charged with was failure to follow traffic signals (running a red light). I know him going to jail will not make it right but it is really upsetting to think he will only pay a fine of 164 dollars for what he did. Getting ahold of the detective that was on the case is next to impossible. I waited a week for him to call me the last time I tried to call him. Also are arraignments open to the public? Who would I need to call to find that out? I am so upset tonight because I just found this out randomly checking the public records website. We were not even notified of any of it.

[carriesmom]

Not sure how your state does it. But I would call the prosecutor that would be handling the case to find out about potential criminal charges. Sometimes the civil ticket will move faster than the criminal matter because they get citing immediate at the scene but criminal has to wait for the filing of charges. And generally yes they are open to the public but not a lot happens at an arraignment in most cases. An arraignment is usually where a defendant is told specifically what the charges are against them, they enter an initial plea (almost always not guilty), and then release conditions are set.

But you would need to contact the person potentially prosecuting the case to get specific answers.

[taracotta7]

I would get an attorney involved. It sounds like it is just a traffic violation. He will probably go in and plea no contest and pay his fine. That way if there is ever a civil suit from your family, he has not admitted guilt. That is just what I would assume he was advised to do by his attorney (either private or public defender). I am not an attorney but my husband is a police officer and he said this is what he has seen more often than not. He said it takes A LOT to be charged with vehicular homicide or negligence.

Traffic court is public in our state. I don't know if you would be able to say anything on behalf of your side though.

((HUGS)) I just hate that you are dealing with this. My heart breaks for your family.

[jessica31876]

it took five months just to file the ticket charging him for the accident. His arraignment is scheduled actually on the five month anniversary. It does not list who the attorney is handling it. Just says state of florida against the guy. I have only talked to the detective twice now once immediately after the accident and then once last month. I have tried to contact him a few other times but he never returned my calls. So I should call the office for the prosecuting attorney? That would be the states attorney office for my county I assume? Is it normal to not be notified of any of this?

[carriesmom]

At this early stage, it can be normal not to be contacted. I would check to see if there is a victim's advocate office for your county. They can be very helpful.

[jessica31876]

Im also wondering what if the guy just does not show up? If he is being charged they would order a warrant at that point? It says mandatory appearance on the info on the records site. I am so frustrated at this point because I have talked to a couple police officers and paramedics and they all told me anytime a fatality is involved in an accident they are supposed to test for drugs/alcohol but the detective told us he did not do it and he is not required to either so I do not know what is true/what is not true

[Ginger_79]

Jessica, I only know the German law system, but I suspect it might be similiar in this case. Here he would indeed only be charged for a traffic law violation. Because for the state that's exactely what he did. He ran over a red light. As that's the law he broke, the traffic court would have to deal with it. Here fines and times you will be without your liscence do depend on how bad the outcome was. Not sure that's the case in your state?

In order to get him to "pay" for the damage he did to your family, you would need to suit him at a civil right court. Here in some cases these things can be combined, then the state is the first party and the family is the second party against him in a trial. But from your words I suspect, your family hasn't officially suit him yet? Because then this likely won't be the case. I strongly suggest you to get legal support, if you are considering it. Your lawer will probably be able to tell you, what is the best approach.

[Angie4b1g]

Unless he did something blatantly obviously more than "run a red light", that is probably all they are charging him with. It sucks.

If it's any comfort to you, which it probably isn't, he has to live with what he did for the rest of his life. I'm sure he's just a regular guy who screwed up and caused all this mess. As easy as it is to make him the bad guy, and I understand he was at fault, try not to forget that he's a person too, and he is probably completely wracked with guilt over this whole thing. I can't imagine having to live with having caused an accident like that.

And, you're right, regardless of what the court does or doesn't do to him, nothing changes. Either way you will have to find a way to forgive and move on, as unfair as that is.

[Stacey42]

I know in my state if you do not show up for traffic court, or pay the fine ahead of time in an admission of no contest, they do issue a warrant for you. I know this because I got my dates messed up, thought my court date for hitting a sign while on ice (failure to control your vehicle) was the 21st when it was the 12th. I realized it late on the 12th and showed up as they were closing for business. It would have been issued the following day for me.

But they wouldn't have come looking for me on it, just had I been pulled over for anything or they'd run into me for some other reason, then I would have been arrested.

[jessica31876]

Angie the guy had over 30 seconds to react to the light (I timed it) He did not run a yellow light which just turned red. There were over a dozen witnesses who were all willing to testify to what they saw. My husband had the second green light and was the third car in line at that light so this guys light turned red, another light cycled through green/yellow/red and then my husband's light turned green. I do not know personally how much more intentional it could get then that. We are still waiting to hear from the attorneys office. My husband talked to the detective and he said as far as he knows he is not being charged with anything other then running a red light. Not even wreckless driving.

[JulieB146]

Angie, I doubt someone who habitually drives recklessly (as this person does, according to his record, from what Jessica has said) really feels that badly. If he did, he might have contacted her family, or apologized, or done something else along those lines. Not everyone feels badly after having caused harm to someone else. You're assuming he's got a full conscience about what he did and has regrets. If anything, he probably regrets how it is affecting HIM, not the family he devastated.

Edit: and I think it's asking Jessica a bit much to "remember he's a person, too".

[Ginger_79]

Right, I'm home now and have a bit more time. Jessica, I believe you are dealing with the wrong people. The police most likely isn't very involved in this phase. And in any case not meant to take care of the court case including the communication with your family. I don't think they do that out of ignorance, but simply because they are the wrong persons to address.

For the state the attorney office will likely take care of everything right now. However, from what you've told us I believe their job is only about the traffic court trial. I strongly doubt they will cover things like what we in Germany call "Schmerzensgeld", pain money. You know, the compensation you have to give to people when you hurt them. I unfortunately don't know the English term for this. It might very well be the case you have to start a civil rights trial against him. As I said, I can only suspect as your system is probably different in some ways.

It sounds to me like Liz had a great piece of advice with the victim's advocate office. I'm sure they can tell you way more detailed what the options are, than the police. And maybe recommend an attorney for your family, who can take care of everything you want to do. And they can most likely provide you with information what are likely outcomes. In Germany the most likely possibility is, that this guy will not end up in jail. Of course he would be charged, but no way to a degree that would result in jail. You seem to be tearing yourself apart over this - and it's easy to understand why - it might be good to get some insight from a professional of what is a realistic thing to expect. And to not feel so left alone with it all.

Sending you lots of strength!

[Angie4b1g]

Originally Posted by JulieB146

Angie, I doubt someone who habitually drives recklessly (as this person does, according to his record, from what Jessica has said) really feels that badly. If he did, he might have contacted her family, or apologized, or done something else along those lines. Not everyone feels badly after having caused harm to someone else. You're assuming he's got a full conscience about what he did and has regrets. If anything, he probably regrets how it is affecting HIM, not the family he devastated.

Edit: and I think it's asking Jessica a bit much to "remember he's a person, too".

I'm not disputing the fact that he intentionally ran the light. But that's not the same as intentionally colliding with another car.

I also definitely did not mean to seem insensitive, so I apologize if it came across that way.

I suppose I find it easier to try to find the best in people, and it just seems like it would be easier to heal by forgiving. The system will almost never give a victim the closure and justice they deserve.

[nanienamou]

Originally Posted by Angie4b1g

I suppose I find it easier to try to find the best in people, and it just seems like it would be easier to heal by forgiving. The system will almost never give a victim the closure and justice they deserve.

I'm totally with you on that. I lost my father in 1999 while my parents were in Cuba. He got in a vehicle with a drunk driver and the driver lost control and went off the road. My dad died in the ambulance. Broken sternum, punctured lung and internal bleeding. He was in pieces.

Anyway, I know the driver had to go through the justice system, but my mom and I never seeked out more info on the guy and the proceedings because, in the end, it did not change a thing and we just wanted to make peace with everything. If you start getting involved with all the legal manners, you're bound to drag out some really bad memories and, in the end, it may take more time to heal. It would not have bring me closure either way.

Totally take this with a grain of salt, Jessica, as we are all different and grieve differently. I don't want to hurt you, just wanted to share how I grieved and healed.

[newfiemountiewife]

I'm in Canada, so I can't really say how the system works, but if it were here, he would likely just get the ticket for the offense that he committed, which was running the red light. I'm not saying it's right, it's just how it is, unless they can prove he intentionally ran into the car.

I'm so sorry. There is no amount of money or jail time that will make any of this better. But I totally understand where you're coming from, that you have lost so much and he gets away with a fine. That isn't fair.

[JulieB146]

Originally Posted by Angie4b1g

I'm not disputing the fact that he intentionally ran the light. But that's not the same as intentionally colliding with another car.

I also definitely did not mean to seem insensitive, so I apologize if it came across that way.

I suppose I find it easier to try to find the best in people, and it just seems like it would be easier to heal by forgiving. The system will almost never give a victim the closure and justice they deserve.

Hi Angie. My mother was pulling out of a parking space back in late September of this year. A 16 year old plowed his car directly head-on into her car. He claimed to the police that he had a seizure of some sort because he hadn't taken his medication--but he didn't have a license to begin with, and the idiot had his younger brother in the car, too.

My mother ended up in the hospital in the ICU for about about three weeks, and one week in the tier just below that, before being sent to a rehab center. She had ten crushed ribs, a broken clavicle, a broken vertebrae that still gives her back trouble and it took her weeks to start recovery not only from the surgery, but from the heavy pain medications she'd been on during that time. She's at home now with her two dogs (one was lost for 12 days while people frantically searched for him-he ran away from the car while she was being put in the ambulance.

There's very little hope she'll ever be recompensed by the family of that teenager or their insurance company for her HUGE pain and recovery.

So, while I know that kid is a person, and I'm usually a bleeding heart about other people and seeing their good side, and I hope this kid learns his lesson (whatever the hell that is), at least he didn't kill my mother, which he could have very well done, if she hadn't been in very good shape to begin with: she's 72 years old, and usually recovery with broken ribs is bleak for folks her age. But if he HAD caused her death, don't think for a minute I'd ever feel forgiving of him for a long, long, time.

I'm blathering on about this partly so you know I'm not giving a knee-jerk reaction to what you wrote. The fact this jerk effectively murdered Jessica's son through his blatant carelessness to me abrogates his rights as a decent human being.

[Julie Billingsley]

Jessica, this situation and your loss is horrible beyond words. It seems that the district attorney only thought a traffic violation would "stick". The burden of proof on vehicular manslaughter is high, and it looks like the DA seems to think a jury/judge would see this as a mere accident. The police clearly messed up if a drug/alcohol test wasn't performed. I'd try to find out if the driver refused to take the test. However, it might have been done and been clear... and they just can't tell you because of the Health Information privacy act. If you want this person to face this in court, you should contact a lawyer to file a civil case against him. I believe people do this so they can get monetary compensation for the losses they have suffered. If this individual has no assets then I'm not sure how that would work out. However if this individual does have assets and the court finds in your favor, then you could see some financial benefit, but it wouldn't result in him serving any jail time or probation.

Okay, now for the personal side of things... back in about 1988, my mom was driving and hit and killed a pedestrian. It was about 9pm and dark outside and she didn't see the man crossing the street. The man was in dark clothing but was in a crosswalk. The crosswalk was not lit. There were no streetlights in the area, just lights in a nearby parking lot. (Testing of the victim later revealed that he had been drunk, but that doesn't really matter.) My mom didn't see him, and she hit him. According to her account and the police investigation, she was not speeding either. There were witnesses and they called 911. The victim was transported to the hospital where he died. My mom was also taken to the hospital in a police car where she took a voluntary blood test for drugs/alcohol (she was clear). My mom was arrested and released. I was called to come get her. I was only in high school at the time. Later that night, a police chaplain came to our house and let us know the man did not make it. My mom was so devastated. It was a true accident in her situation, but she did fail to see him and he was in a crosswalk. We feared she would be arrested and charged. But she never was. My mom's car insurance coverage paid out the full allowed amount to this man's family. He was estranged from his family and lived in a different state than them, but insurance still paid them. The family did not bring a civil suit against my mom because honestly, we didn't have any assets and it would likely have been ruled an accident in court. She did not even get a ticket. Not even a ticket, which still stuns me. If I had been related to that victim, I would be furious over that.

I share this with you, Jessica, because I want you to know that a lot of accidents including ones with a death, do not even get a ticket. I'm glad in your situation that at least this person will face SOMETHING. Hopefully it will prevent him from working in an occupation where he drives for a living. No penalty this person ever faces will be fair though. You've lost too much for justice to ever be rendered fully. My heart continues to break for you. ((hugs))

[jessica31876]

I do totally get there are accidents which cannot be avoided. I wish I could show you the intersection and the vehicles (ours and the other guys). The speed this guy had to be going when he hit my husband's vehicle is insane. Our vehicle was nearly split in half down the middle (passenger side was in the drivers side) The speed limit however is 45. He was driving a full sized SUV and I might be the only one with this viewpoint but if you run a red light especially one that has been red for awhile (more the enough time to stop) it is defenitely intentional. It may not cause an accident then or tomorrow or the next day but if you did it often enough it eventually would. In any event I did not want to upset anyone or anything. I saw the info on the public information site late last night and thought maybe someone might know what it means because I have absolutely zero experience with arraignments and court proceedings and whatnot. The detective told me when I first spoke to him that he was defenitely going to be charged with a crime most likely vehicular manslaughter and then seeing just a traffic citation I had no idea what was going on. My husband asked the detective today when he spoke to him about the blood alcolhol testing and he told my husband unless the guy consents to a test he cannot do one because it would be considered illegal search and seizure and they could be sued over it. The detective did tell my husband he would most likely lose his license though but all that will mean is he will drive without a license and without insurance so if he caused another accident that person would have no recourse against him.

[jessica31876]

to add even more heartache my daughter had a good friend who died in a car accident last Thursday who was only 20 (he lost control on a turn late at night and was the only one in the accident) and my niece had her cousin killed in a car accident on Wednesday (he was walking on a dark road wearing dark clothes.) He was only 18. My niece is only 10 and I am just so sad for her (she is the little girl in my profile picture). Just to much really and it being christmas I am trying so hard to make it special for my daughter and son and it is hard when everyone is just hurting so much.

[marlathrall]

I'm still praying for you family, Jessica. Hang in there and keep strong.

[ColleenSwerb]

Jess, I can't even begin to put myself in your shoes, so I hope I'm not overstepping by commenting. But maybe you shouldn't put so much pressure on yourself to make everything special for everyone. You all went through (and are still going through with your husband's medical issues) a horrific thing. That's not going to go away because you give everyone a "special" Christmas. This could be the most perfect Christmas on record ever in your family and you know what? It's still probably gonna suck because this is the first year you don't have your son to celebrate with. No amount of special can overcome that I don't think, I don't know.
I know we all grieve in our own ways and everything, I just hate to see you putting so much pressure on yourself to make everything special and perfect for everyone else.....

[YepBrook]

Hi Jessica, just wanted to say that (since I'm new here) a few nights ago I read much of your blog trying to find out what this "accident" was you've mentioned on here a few times. Well I was surprised to discover what happened to your son and husband! I sat up in bed reading n the dark on my smart phone as my husband snored soundly beside me and my kids both safely, and much alive (which I am now more thankful for than ever), slept. And I sobbed. Because I honestly can feel your pain, not exactly (of course) but in sympathy and in my own personal fears... and the fact that it is a mother's worst nightmare. It's what I pray will never happen to my family every night.

So, I want you to know I know your story and I can understand how the pain of it can certainly turn into anger. Something so ugly and venomous that it destroys the life you still have, the lives your other son and daughter still have, and your marriage. I really hope that despite how everything turns out with this irresponsible man who took the life of your son, you can find peace and healing for your broken heart.

I also echo what Colleen just said. I think having a special Christmas is embracing the fact that you are all together, that you love and support one another in grieving and don't expect anything "fake" of each other just for the sake of calling it special. I hope everything with this Traffic violation goes smoothly and that, at the very least, this man will not legally be able to drive his weapon anymore.

[jessica31876]

I know I cant make it perfect....it is like if I have something to concentrate on like decorating the house or planning christmas events it helps me to not be so sad all the time. I also feel better when I am with my family and I feel like before the accident we took a lot for granted so now I want to do more with them and make more memories together rather then just say someday we will go here or someday we will do this...KWIM?