Jon and Kate +8 (*spoilers*)

[ccouch]

ya know, after I posted that reply, I did a quick search online. (note to self: do not spend any more time googling reality tv stars. go scrap a LO or something!)

anyhoo - YIKES!! I saw those bikini pics too. The tag said that it was at the Gosselin residence. So, um, where were all the kids while she was sunbathing at J&K's house? I read she was a school teacher. Maybe Cara & Mady will have her in homeroom. Lovely.

[Megan Turnidge]

While I advocate very strongly for maintaining a marriage and WORKING hard to keep it together, there are a few things I would not expect someone to just set aside.... physical, emotional, sexual, or substance abuse AND infidelity. Kate is rude and mean, but that does not excuse Jon's actions in any way. If your wife is mean, you try and work it out... you don't just run off and commit adultery. I would not expect a mother to stay in a relationship with a man who is screwing someone else. I wouldn't even want to look at my husband if he'd done something like that. That's unfair to expect someone to stay in a relationship like that. It was pretty obvious in the way they were speaking that Jon had cheated, but they never flat-out said it.

[scrapperjade]

Originally Posted by mturnidge

While I advocate very strongly for maintaining a marriage and WORKING hard to keep it together, there are a few things I would not expect someone to just set aside.... physical, emotional, sexual, or substance abuse AND infidelity. Kate is rude and mean, but that does not excuse Jon's actions in any way. If your wife is mean, you try and work it out... you don't just run off and commit adultery. I would not expect a mother to stay in a relationship with a man who is screwing someone else. I wouldn't even want to look at my husband if he'd done something like that. That's unfair to expect someone to stay in a relationship like that. It was pretty obvious in the way they were speaking that Jon had cheated, but they never flat-out said it.

I agree with everything, but especially the bolded parts.

[lizzyfizzy]

i agree with what you said too traci about it being a fallen world and it is so sad. i get so upset when people who obviously love one another let circumstances ruin the lives of their children and themselves. it breaks my heart.

jami- just so you know and everyone else knows, i've been around the block. i KNOW it's not cut and dry. the fact still remains however that adults can be VERY selfish and when you bring little lives into the picture you need to try a hell of a long time before giving everything up. my stance on this will not sway no matter what anyone says. my parents have been seperated and almost divorced too many friggin times to count. do you know what that taught me? not that people shouldn't fight but that in the end if you love someone or ever did love someone for the sake of your gorgeous children- you CAN work it out. they are now married 28 years and happier than ever. dennis and i almost got a divorce as well and i'm not talking one fight, we threatened one another. we were on our way to see a divorce lawyer when it hit us both that those three children we had made deserved more happiness than we ever did and for those reasons we sought out help and we are happier than ever. i hate to judge all of those whom are divorced or whom are going through it cause i know its a painful time. i just really wish more adults would really put their kids happiness first and then move from there. in many cases divorce is best- i get that. but not when 50% of marriages are failing. that's not normal. too many people are living in a self gratifying world and not seeing that their children come first.

wow. thats long.

[lauren grier]

well... here's the other thing.. we don't KNOW what has really gone on in their lives. Who knows.. maybe more happened. I do know, for me, for connor, it's better this way- you've told me as such yourself ^_^ .. You can't really lump all peolpe who are going through a divorce into one category (obviously you know this).. I do agree, that it is sad that divorce rates are SO high.. but you also have to look at other things too.. too many people get married for the wrong reasons, too many people rush into marriage etc etc.. Those situations on top of situations like mine, sometimes there is really just no fixing it.I think it's wonderful that some people can work out their marriages-- but those situations, are different.. the two people love each other deep inside and are willing. A hate filled marriage is not good for any child.. and no amount of therapy will MAKE you love someone or MAKE you happy in a situation (or make the abuse go away, or on and on and on) That is all on the individual person. That base.. that love has to already be there..

[newfiemountiewife]

In my case, my parents were married because she was 19 years old and pregnant. Maybe they would have gotten married eventually if she hadn't, but I honestly don't think they would have. They were just 2 very different people who DID try to do right by us, by doing the "right thing", only to have it deteriorate in the end anyway.

[Angie4b1g]

Originally Posted by lizzyfizzy

i think divorce is complete and utter bullshit. *unless physical harm is being inflicted on any level. including drug use and mental abuse, etc.

I disagree. It would not have been better for me or my children to remain in a loveless marriage with a man who thought sleeping with my friends was completely reasonable.

We're ALL happier now. Even the kids.

And to answer previous posts - not all divorces are bitter and petty. My ex and I get along fine now, and he gets along fine with my current husband. We're both over each other so there's really nothing to fight about. I don't get jealous of his girlfriends, and he doesn't care that I'm remarried. We co-parent, we sit next to each other at soccer games, and we raise the kids effectively as a 3 person team.

None of this has anything to do with Jon and Kate, and I'll leave my opinions about them out of this post. I just wanted to defend the divorced girls. I'd much rather my kids grow up in 2 happy homes than one miserable one.

ETA: I stayed with him for 11 years. It's not like I didn't try.

[iJenny]

Originally Posted by lizzyfizzy

i agree with what you said too traci about it being a fallen world and it is so sad. i get so upset when people who obviously love one another let circumstances ruin the lives of their children and themselves. it breaks my heart.

jami- just so you know and everyone else knows, i've been around the block. i KNOW it's not cut and dry. the fact still remains however that adults can be VERY selfish and when you bring little lives into the picture you need to try a hell of a long time before giving everything up. my stance on this will not sway no matter what anyone says. my parents have been seperated and almost divorced too many friggin times to count. do you know what that taught me? not that people shouldn't fight but that in the end if you love someone or ever did love someone for the sake of your gorgeous children- you CAN work it out. they are now married 28 years and happier than ever. dennis and i almost got a divorce as well and i'm not talking one fight, we threatened one another. we were on our way to see a divorce lawyer when it hit us both that those three children we had made deserved more happiness than we ever did and for those reasons we sought out help and we are happier than ever. i hate to judge all of those whom are divorced or whom are going through it cause i know its a painful time. i just really wish more adults would really put their kids happiness first and then move from there. in many cases divorce is best- i get that. but not when 50% of marriages are failing. that's not normal. too many people are living in a self gratifying world and not seeing that their children come first.

wow. thats long.

I love that you saved my fingers from all the typing, because you know I totally agree with you.

[lizzyfizzy]

i love you jenny.

just a reminder: i am a girl who got married to a boy she hardly knew at 17. pregnant at 16. if i can survive this marriage i believe that a hell of a lot of people who get divorced can save theirs. like i said, i do understand there are different circumstances but more often than not divorce is not necessary. i will be an advocate for happy families. we can put it that way. in the end if you believe divorce made your family happier, my hat's off to you.

[scrapperjade]

Originally Posted by lizzyfizzy

i love you jenny.

just a reminder: i am a girl who got married to a boy she hardly knew at 17. pregnant at 16. if i can survive this marriage i believe that a hell of a lot of people who get divorced can save theirs. like i said, i do understand there are different circumstances but more often than not divorce is not necessary. i will be an advocate for happy families. we can put it that way. in the end if you believe divorce made your family happier, my hat's off to you.

I do agree with you too Lizzy. I agreed with Megan as well, but I do see your over-all point (which I don't think is that divorce is unacceptable under ALL circumstances because you said there are some situations that merit it). And I totally agree that too many people divorce too easily. I mean, look at the divorce rate. 50 years ago it was super low. People stuck it out. Now it's almost as if people get married for the fun of it, going into it with the attitude, "We can always divorce if we get bored". And thats a sad thing to see.

For me, I am against divorce too. I'm not against seperation if the situation needs it (emotional, physical, mental abuses etc), and would only divorce if my husband were to cheat on me. I would definitely give it my all to save my marraige if it were at all possible!!

[crystalbella77]

I agree Jaedyn.

I think it's sad that neither one seems to be willing to give their all in order to save it. If this has been going on for 7-8 months and they haven't done anything yet....that is so sad.

TLC released a statment saying that the show was on temporary hiatus for at leat 6 weeks. we will see I guess if they do decide to do the right thing for their kids....

[Tracie Stroud]

I won't be watching anymore.

[NettieB]

Perhaps it isn't the big D - don't mean Dallas - that we're getting after here? perhaps it's the underlying "walk away" issue?

Coming from the got abandonment issues to fill a Samsonite warehouse woman here (am workin' on that) - so Bias. Big time. Yet perhaps that is what really is the root of all of this, how easy it is to throw in the towel and walk. Especially more for some than others. With or without accountability for the blow back that their walking away may cause for others.

So maybe throw out the big D - and we all agree? it's the walk away that causes the hurt, the giving up, giving up on of what could have been or should have been or might have been, whenever the initial walk happened.

[lizzyfizzy]

Originally Posted by NettieB

Perhaps it isn't the big D - don't mean Dallas - that we're getting after here? perhaps it's the underlying "walk away" issue?

yes, this is what it is for me. i guess i didn't think to say that. i read a book called the walk out woman. it's so sad that things so often come to giving up and just walking away.

[Angie4b1g]

There's also a chance they aren't divorcing at all, and this is just a giant publicity stunt.

[Kara]

If it is a publicity stunt, all I can say is that it's a pretty sad one given the fact that all of this is chronicled on video for their children to view down the road.

[newfiemountiewife]

I agree. But I don't think it is, unless they are very good actors.

[iJenny]

Originally Posted by NettieB

Perhaps it isn't the big D - don't mean Dallas - that we're getting after here? perhaps it's the underlying "walk away" issue?

Coming from the got abandonment issues to fill a Samsonite warehouse woman here (am workin' on that) - so Bias. Big time. Yet perhaps that is what really is the root of all of this, how easy it is to throw in the towel and walk. Especially more for some than others. With or without accountability for the blow back that their walking away may cause for others.

So maybe throw out the big D - and we all agree? it's the walk away that causes the hurt, the giving up, giving up on of what could have been or should have been or might have been, whenever the initial walk happened.

Nettie for the win!! Yes, thats exactly what I was trying to say in all my ramblings. I'm against the giving up without a fight part of divorce. I'm sick of people just walking out on their families because they don't care enough to fight for the happiness of their children. If Jeff and I had divorced, it would have meant a more peaceful home for our children. BUT... we worked so hard for a year and a half in counselling and now, not only do we have a peaceful home for our kids, but our marriage is still intact! I would never say that a couple should remain together miserable and angry and hateful. Thats NEVER good for kids to see. But go get help! Go work on it! I can *almost* guarantee that things will get better if both people are committed to making it work!

[rochelle789]

Originally Posted by Lilcameronsmommy

But go get help! Go work on it! I can *almost* guarantee that things will get better if both people are committed to making it work!

But do we know that they didn't go get help? They very well may have, but feel no need to share that with the public. I can understand that.

I recently divorced and in no way, shape or form do my ex-husband and I feel that if only we were committed it could have worked out. We worked at it for years, and it just didn't work out. Legally, it was easy for us to divorce, but getting to the point of making that decision was anything but. Most people with children don't take these things lightly.

[sczos911]

Originally Posted by rochelle789

But do we know that they didn't go get help? They very well may have, but feel no need to share that with the public. I can understand that.

That's not "their" style - KWIM? They share EVERYTHING with the public - why not that? Why not that they were in couseling?

Just how much they are in the public eye & all the stuff that has been unfolding, I feel that in my gut that trying and counseling didn't happen. I am sure it would have been dug up or brought up by now if they did. But it hasn't.

I see it as just giving up and I think that this is happening way too often now. I'm lucky - I'm in a marriage that is good, but when I see the staggering, gut wrentching statistics on how many marriages actually last, it breaks my heart.

I have seen bits and pieces of the show and disliked it. Not even this will get me to watch. I can't stand either one of them & think that at this point, the show should stop. I can't watch something like this with believing what I do about marriage and family.

[crystalbella77]

It's not a publicity stunt. Divorce filings are public record. It's just sooo sad..

Nettie rocks! That's exactly what I meant!!

[lizzyfizzy]

ditto to jenny and steph!!

[LeeAndra]

This is why people are not meant to have 6 children the same age as one another. No one has sextuplets naturally for a reason... and it's because it's too much work and too much stress on the parents. Dogs, cats, other mammals... all capable of raising litters. Happens all the time. Humans are not capable of such and only reproduce litters when they take science into their own hands. I wish people would not mess with the natural order of things so much. I am not opposed to IVF, but having five, six, eight kids the same age is not right.

Aside from that, how dumb is Jon with all his dalliances?! There are obvious plausible reasons why Miss No Name would be all up in a reality star's business, but for him to not be more discreet... insane. He knows the paps follow him around everywhere, and then to go out and get wasted with some lady who is not your old lady knowing that it's exactly the kind of thing that will bring the wolves out... how can you not realize these are pictures your children will see, if not now in years to come, and know what you did and that you didn't care who knew it?! Sure, maybe they didn't actually have physical relations, but wouldn't you be more guarded with your behavior in general knowing you're a 'star' and paps will be recording your every move? Wouldn't you be more respectful of your wife, even if you were not in love with her anymore, and your kids than that knowing how it looks on the outside to be seen all around town and on vacation with a single woman you are not related to?! Why risk the questions and doubt?

I am not a fan of Kate, either, but Jon's recent behavior has just blown me away with its selfishness.

[lizzyfizzy]

*sigh* i suppose he does all of that for the happiness of his children, LA!! don't ya think?!?!?!

[Angie4b1g]

Filing for divorce doesn't mean much. My ex inlaws have filed 5 or 6 times and never actually gotten a divorce.

Not saying J&K are or aren't, just saying that the fact that they filed it in court doesn't mean anything.

[lizzyfizzy]

interesting, angie. i thought when you filed that was that.

[Angie4b1g]

Nope. You file, then there's however long of a waiting period (depending on state laws, and whether or not there are kids), then you set a date for the hearing. Up until the actual hearing, you can back out at any time.

At least that's how it was in Michigan. I'm sure it's a bit different in PA, but either way I'm pretty sure there's still a mandatory waiting period of some kind, especially with kids.

[lizzyfizzy]

oh, gotcha. that makes sense.

[Angie4b1g]

The guy that does my nails thinks they are gonna actually get divorced, and then have a new show - Jon and Kate Back Together.

[lizzyfizzy]

oh my word. can you imagine putting everyone through that? my husband said they are gonna call the show kate plus 8 and sometimes jon and his ugly girlfriend.

[rachaelsscraps]

Well hey everyone, there's a new show on "WE TV" called "Raising Sextuplets" about a husband and wife with a set of sextuplets. Let's see how many years it takes them to go thru this type of situation from being in front of cameras 24/7. I wouldn't do the show if I were them, seeing what's going on with J&K.

[CA Dreamer]

Originally Posted by lizzyfizzy

oh my word. can you imagine putting everyone through that? my husband said they are gonna call the show kate plus 8 and sometimes jon and his ugly girlfriend.

OMGosh, I almost spit out my drink!

[lizzyfizzy]

Originally Posted by CA Dreamer

OMGosh, I almost spit out my drink!

good times.